Limos are dangerous

"Manwich - now Keto-Friendly" (manwich) 10/08/2018 at 01:27 • Filed to: None

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I recently heard about !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! in upstate New York:

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Of note, 18 of the 20 were in the limo. And what I found surprising is not a single passenger in the back of the limo survived like they probably would have in a regular vehicle.

Why is that? Well basically it seems that limos are dangerous.

Here is a crash test of a crappy old Lincoln Town car limo:

Newer limos like this 300C-based limo hold up better structurally:

But as you could see in the first video, the #1 issue is the lack of seat belts and/or seat belt usage by limo passengers.

Of course in the recent crash, it was a stretch limo that used the Ford Excursion as the base.

I looked for crash videos for the Ford Excursion and couldn’t find any. But here is a crash test of a 2006 Ford F250 that used the same basic chassis as the Excursion. The results are not good:

AestheticsInMotion > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly 10/08/2018 at 02:18

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I knew this 300-based limo I spotted earlier this week would come in handy.

Looks like everyone is safely buckled in at the back of the vehicle!

atfsgeoff > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly 10/08/2018 at 02:21

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20,000lbs of stretch excursion going 60mph: ain’t nobody surviving that.

quick calculations put that at 3.2 megajoules of kinetic energy. About the same as 3.5lbs of TNT.

NKato > AestheticsInMotion 10/08/2018 at 03:05

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Even more problematic, the rear wheels look like they’re bent inwards. Is this 300 a FWD?

NKato > atfsgeoff 10/08/2018 at 03:07

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20,000 pounds? More like 6 ,000. Regular cars tend to tip the scales at 4,000. An extra car length will usually add the same weight in frame and body sheet metal, but not account for drive train weight.

BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind > NKato 10/08/2018 at 07:37

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Google tells me that the 2001 Excursion stock was 6650-7200lbs. Let’s use 7000 for easy math. While the extra frame and bodywork may not add much weight (I’ll be generous and say only 1000 lbs), have you ever seen the inside of a limo? The couches, bars, lighting, carpet, let’s give that a weight of 2000lbs, getting us up to an even 10,000lbs unladen.  Plus let’s say 250lbs in fuel.

18 people x 150lbs avg = 2750. So my rough estimate would mean that the limo weighted 13,000lbs at the time of the accident. Add to that high speed and a likely very rusty frame and the results ain’t gonna be good. 

Averyrm - GTI YUP > BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind 10/08/2018 at 08:10

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For a data point: 2002 Excursion v10 actual scale weight was 7620 with 190 lb driver, full tank of gas and nothing else. Ford was pretty optimistic when they published curb weights.

Mercedes Streeter > NKato 10/08/2018 at 08:18

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Camber like that isn't uncommon on RWD vehicles. My smarts all have a more aggressive angle than those do!

Zaxbys > NKato 10/08/2018 at 08:50

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The 300 is rwd and IRS. I think you’re equating rear wheel drive with a live axle.

Dusty Ventures > NKato 10/08/2018 at 09:38

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To add to Brian’s (solid) calculations, the 20-passenger Excursion Super Stretch is 36 feet long. A stock Excursion is 19 feet, which means they added a whopping 17 feet of car. Adding that much structure and distance between the wheels means a bigger, stronger (and heavier) frame with extra bracing to keep the middle from sagging. Basically, the ratio between added length and added weight isn’t linear, it’s a curve, because the bigger the gap the stronger the frame needs to be to keep the whole thing rigid. And w hile I can’t give any solid numbers on limo weights at any length (coachbuilders don’t like to release those figures) , I do know my Town Car hearse gained about 1,4 00 lbs in the conversion. So honestly saying the Excursion is 2,000 lbs over stock is probably pretty conservative.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly 10/08/2018 at 09:46

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who knew being a limo driver could be such a dangerous job. but if you take a structure made to handle a 4000lb sedan, and then add 3,000 lbs behind it. Your going to have a bad day.

CobraJoe > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly 10/08/2018 at 10:02

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If I remember, those mid 00's Ford Extended cabs were known for collapsing around the driver like that. The crew cab and regular cab versions were noticeably safer.

I can’t find any pictures or video to back up that claim, but the extended cab isn’t the closest analog to the Excursion either.

ttyymmnn > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly 10/08/2018 at 13:33

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Let’s not forget about Vladimir Konstantinov . Is there any video of unbelted crash dummies in the back of a limo?

ranwhenparked > Manwich - now Keto-Friendly 10/11/2018 at 00:30

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I believe the Excursion was over the weight limit for mandatory crash testing, so it was never tested by NHTSA. Could be wrong though.

But, I do seem to remember Cross Lander USA proposing that they weld heavy steel plates into the chassis of the ARO 244 to bring the weight up enough to avoid a lot of the safety issues that kept it from being US-legal, think crash testing was one of them.